Call Summary: Spiritual Journey and Career Alignment

Overview

A divinely orchestrated conversation between Gary in Austin and Ian in Berkeley Hills, where both men discovered profound alignment in their spiritual journeys, entrepreneurial callings, and mutual rejection of traditional corporate employment. The call served as divine confirmation for both men - Ian providing confidence about work choices, Gary providing confidence about relationship decisions. Both are navigating spiritual awakenings, difficult breakups, and the tension between worldly security and spiritual obedience.

Key Topics Discussed

Ian's Current Situation and Setup

• Berkeley Hills Studio: Beautiful studio apartment in the hills with stunning views, walking distance from UC Berkeley football stadium
• Work Arrangement: Working with WAG providing "few thousand dollars a month" cash flow while building City Farmers
• City Farmers Progress: Close to being properly incorporated, working with lawyer on fork of Nouns
• Kansas City Greenhouse: Making progress on greenhouse project with deep tech and climate tech VC connections
• Technical Project: Working on custom Android boot development, hoping Gemini 3 can help

Gary's Sabbatical and Spiritual Journey

• Three-Month Sabbatical: After Alpha Schools consulting ended in July, took time to go deep in God's word
• Rome Vatican Experience: Attended AI conference at Vatican, thought-provoking experience
• New Pastor: Found pastor few hours from Austin who has facilitated healing of cancer and other miracles
• Baptism: Water baptized October 6, 2025, after 4.5 years exploring faith
• Manufacturing Opportunity: Tulsa opportunity with Lyle Alexander fell through due to financing

Ian's Relationship Crisis and Spiritual Awakening

• Difficult Breakup: Ending relationship with 34-year-old woman who had abortion at 27, "turbo liberal"
• Values Misalignment: Woman refused to understand pro-life perspective: "Those women are brainwashed"
• Return to Church: Started attending church again past couple weeks after years away
• Catholic Exploration: Attending mass with Grimes Daniel in Berkeley despite Protestant upbringing
• Divine Messages: Receiving repeated messages to "let this go, something much better is right around the corner"

Key Relationship Insight:

"We didn't bring out the best in each other" - Recognition that pushed deeper faith journey

The Employment Philosophy Discussion

Ian's Entrepreneurial Heritage:

• Mother was entrepreneur (seamstress, then tanning salon owner)
• Manager at Domino's offered $96k+ position: "I drive a brand new Corvette and an F150. This could be you."
• Ian's response: "If I'm 35 and it's obvious I'm not gonna make it, I could always come back to this"

Serial Unemployment Pattern:

• "I'm 30. I'll be 31 in January. I've had more jobs than years I've been alive."
• "I'm serially unemployable. I get fired. I take up too much ownership."
• "It's always been incredibly offensive to my spirit to tie myself down"

Gary's Corporate Experience:

• Alpha Schools put tracker on computers, constant surveillance
• Got fired from consulting after checking out due to sabotage of good-hearted efforts
• "It felt so offensive to my spirit that wants to have agency"

Spiritual Understanding of Work

Freedom as Expensive:

"Freedom is the most expensive thing God has put on this earth. Because Satan has dominion. And he does not want us to be free and he does not want us in touch with God."

Creating vs. Consuming:

"I do think more Christians should feel like that is what they're supposed to do. That to me is like a lot more in the image of God who created something."

Prison Sentence Analogy:

• Four-year vesting schedules viewed as "prison sentences"
• Ian on Gary taking corporate job: "Like putting an animal in a zoo cage... the sad polar bear in their itty bitty enclosure"

Gary's Ex-Girlfriend Update

• Final Confirmation: Gary told ex about church and potential miracles
• Her Response: Called him crazy (nicely) on phone call
• Gary's Realization: "She doubled down on being anti-Christ... that was the final confirmation I needed"
• Moving On: After dedicating significant love and resources, time to fully move on

Both Men's Relationship Philosophy

Not Projecting Change:

• Both recognize tendency to project own transformation onto partners
• Gary: "I have to very selectively project my own change journey on other people"
• Ian: Learning same lesson through painful breakup

Trusting God's Timing:

• Gary: "God has prepared the exact right one for you... they only show up once you're in obedience"
• Both believe won't find right partner while compromising values

Divine Orchestration Recognition

Mutual Confirmation:

• Ian: "This conversation was ordained. You needed to hear from me. You needed my confidence about work."
• Gary: "And I need your confidence about relationships."

God Sending Messengers:

• Gary: "God sends me messengers" through people
• Morning text from SF friend who dreamed of Gary on major podcast
• Ian feeling need to reach out: "No wonder I felt the need to reach out to you"

Current Job Search Dilemma

Gary's Options:

• Interview process with Perplexity for DevRel role
• Friend warns it's "super grind culture"
• Coding bootcamp in Austin showing interest
• Looking for "few thousand dollars a month part-time thing"

The Core Tension:

• Parents programmed belief: "Great opportunity to just suck it up at some company"
• Spiritual reality: "It's spiritually really hard for me to imagine myself motivated by a four-year vesting schedule"

California Spiritual Mission

Ian's Perspective:

• "There's a lot of Satan here, but we got to take California back, brother"
• Growing Christian scene with Grimes Daniel's group
• Despite weirdness of Catholicism, finds value in community worship

Gary's Potential SF Role:

• If takes job there: "There's a lot of work to do there"
• Recognition of spiritual desert needing workers
• Friend with "spirit of lesbian" had prophetic dream of Gary on major podcast

City Farmers Vision

The Mission:

• "I wanted to make things that were beautiful and useful"
• Addressing 25% of waste stream being food
• $100 billion worth of scrap steel and aluminum in landfills
• Working with nonprofits on sustainable solutions

Financial Reality:

• WAG partnership provides baseline income
• Allows continued work on passion project
• Model Gary seeks to replicate

Theological Alignment

Shared Views:

• LGBT as "spiritual sickness that causes people to identify with their sin"
• Abortion as fundamental values issue
• Culture where "up is down, down is up"
• Need to speak truth even when uncomfortable

Denominational Unity:

• Both see Catholics and Protestants as allies against bigger threats
• Gary visited Paul's remains in Rome, felt reverence despite some Catholic practices feeling wrong
• "Dedicating time to bashing Catholics or Catholics bashing Protestants feels like pretty stupid use of time"

Key Quotes

Ian on entrepreneurship: "I'd rather live with the bitter taste of failure than the poison of regret."

On traditional employment: "Why would I live this one life I have not just swinging for the fences, not just going for it?"

Gary on spiritual offense: "I don't use the word offensive lightly... It's spiritually really hard for me to imagine myself motivated by a four-year vesting schedule."

Ian on Gary's potential job: "The idea of you, it feels like putting an animal in a zoo cage. Like when you see the sad polar bear in their itty bitty enclosure just going in circles."

On divine orchestration: "This conversation was ordained. You needed to hear from me. You needed my confidence about work. And I need your confidence about relationships."

On creating: "That to me is like a lot more in the image of God who created something from nothing."

Ian's mother's influence: "The inspiration for my life is my mother... watching her never have a boss, really, and just doing the things that she wanted to do."

On compromise: "Your friendship with someone and optimism about their ability to turn their life around... doesn't need to apply to your romantic relationship unless it's God ordained."

On spiritual warfare: "Satan loves it when you're overthinking and not thinking about the serious question of what does God want me to do moving forward."

Final confirmation: "If God sent Ian, [the message] is don't fucking take a four-year vesting contract for some random company you're not even excited about. It's like imagine getting married and you're already not excited."

Action Items / Takeaways

• Both men commit to staying in touch more frequently
• Ian to send Gary information about Muslim expansion in Texas
• Gary to update Ian on job search decisions
• Potential meetup if Gary visits Bay Area or Ian visits Texas
• Both continuing to trust God's timing for right relationships
• Mutual support in choosing entrepreneurship over corporate employment
• Recognition that conversation was divine confirmation for both

Spiritual Insights

The conversation revealed profound spiritual alignment between two men at crossroads in their lives. Both see traditional corporate employment as spiritually offensive to their God-given nature as creators. Ian's 30+ jobs before age 31 and Gary's recent firing from Alpha Schools demonstrate their mutual "unemployability" in systems that demand conformity over creation. The timing of their conversation - as Gary faces job interviews and Ian processes his breakup - was recognized by both as divine orchestration. Their shared understanding that "freedom is the most expensive thing God has put on this earth" because "Satan has dominion" provides theological framework for their struggle. Both men are choosing the uncertain path of entrepreneurship and spiritual obedience over the worldly security their families and society expect, trusting that being in alignment with God's calling is more important than financial stability. The call served as mutual confirmation: neither should compromise their spiritual calling for earthly security, whether in career or relationships.